Shattered Kingdoms

In one of those threads I linked, she talks about warlocks being trash except for when they are in the druids, because then you can just range kill them all day long.

I agree that kin has failed to utilize his class's potential. I also think many people ignore the content of his posts because of his style of writing, and his history of posting on the forums.

I think that the various buffs warlocks have received have made warlocks playable. They're not near the top of the pack, but they're not at the bottom, either, as far as classes go. That being said, I probably would not play a warlock unless I were in a cabal or tribunal that happened to mesh very well with the warlock spell set. Let's analyze warlocks from a few perspectives - solo offensive capability, survivability, utility, and group pvp

Solo Offensive Capability
melee output: nearly nonexistent
spells that if you don't save against will seriously you up: none (think sleep, fear, petrification, charm, FoD, and even maledictions)
damage spells: very solid against unprepped characters and MR builds. Weak vs prepped opponents
locking a kill: fire elemental bashes/trips, and water elemental has reach and trips I believe. Not terrible.
range: warlocks are arguably the best class in the game for ranged combat, and have hit-and-run tactics available, which make it very difficult to go on the offensive against a warlock.
Bottom line: While there are situations where warlocks are brutally effective, their abilities are limited to select situations and select opponents.

Warlocks are very survivable on account of stone skin, IG, RE, and access to wands/staves, as well as light armor, okay HPs, and permanent access to third row.

Warlocks also have the least utility of any of the casting classes. They can't identify, gate, enchant, or use scrolls. However, access to wands and staves, as well as tracking, a beefy tank, and IG for pve purposes give the warlock more utility than a non-caster.

The warlock is a wonderful support class that gives his group solid range capabilities and is great at healing. In group pvp, there is probably an opponent who is vulnerable to his spells, as well.

If 10 is the best possible score, 1 is the worst possible score, and 5 is meant to be average compared to the other classes, I'd give the warlock something like -

Solo Offense: 4
Survivability: 9
Utility: 5
Group pvp: 7

Since I greatly value solo pk ability, especially against all possible opponents, I would not be likely to choose warlock. Given their limited offensive abilities, one would expect greater utility. They are very survivable and quite useful for group pvp, though.

I would rate solo offense higher, if you are in a tribunal or Harlequins, Druids or Midnight Council - maybe a 6 or 7. Group PvP should be a 9 or 10, since healing rays is the best healing spell for PvP and after the recent warlock buff package cone of cold is equivalent to a perfect weather condition call lightning.

Not sure why warlocks still have that overpowered spell detect poison, though. Dulrik should clearly nerf that and replace it with identify.

Druid or harlie warlock could be a 7, sure. These are combos worth playing. Otherwise, agree to disagree? Healing rays is definitely good, but there are a handful of classes I would rather have supporting my group in pvp.

You'd have to refresh my memory on why cone of cold is so strong now, though. I haven't played in a while. Did the spell just get buffed, or is this a side-effect of introducing AP enchants or something?

What would you say is better between a warlock and a necromancer?

Warlocks have more offensive and defensive options than necromancers and are a whole lot less vulnerable. Warlocks also totally destroy necros 1v1. The only necromancer I encountered (Misha) on my Peacekeeper centaur warlock (Pyras, who was generally pretty weak) did nothing to me except help me get enough experience to GM.

Also, thanks for reminding me not to bother removing you from my foes list.

zap ethereal c dispel elemental o all bash warlock
or
c blindness warlock c fod warlock

warlocks have a clear advantage in ranged spell combat, but I think it comes down to who gets their spells off first.
If you have double heal potions to quaff, magma spray shouldn't be a problem.

jreid, first of all you have to get in the room with the warlock instead of getting fireballed from a few rooms away which will absolutely murder controls/animates. Secondly, if you go ethereal the warlock is just going to chase you ethereal and magma you to death. Even then, if a warlock chooses to fight a necro in the same room, all he has to do is spam cone of cold at the necro and the undead controls will drop before the elemental does. The only way in which a necro can kill a warlock 1v1 is if the warlock has terrible enchants and the necro manages to get him in the room, or if the necro arms a few controls with some ranged weapons and hopes the warlock doesn't notice until after they break through his second-row pet and his stone skin. It also helps warlocks that their elementals take zero damage from all animates/controls unless the necro invests into high-level weaponry.

Lastly, unless the necro has access to RE, he will literally take 75% or more damage from a sticky magma. Non-MR race casters can get instantly dropped in a single sticky magma, and MR races still take a whole lot of damage.


The only warlock I killed with Surrit was Adroan's warlock, and that's because he's Adroan and he's bad, and I could guarantee that he was going to eventually just come running up to Kol's Moot looking for a fight like a junkie seeking a fix. Even then I didn't even bother trying to kill him in our fights because nailing down a warlock is next to impossible. Instead, I just spammed energy drain on him until he fled, which was just as amusing.

I recall two other warlocks I saw as Surrit, one was Finney's warlock whose name I forgot, some green-sands sprite, and all we did was dance around Exile and never face off, because neither of us was interested in giving the other the upper hand. The other warlock I faced was Eponine, who attacked me in Kol's Moot and still almost killed me. I think I cast curse at her like 10 times and none of them went through, and I still have no idea if she was using MR or just had a good will save.

You get three shadowy wights with diamond massives and a mirror image stave. I will spam cone of cold on your group, and you spam FoD on me and we will see who wins.

It's still a draw at best. Regardless, I can promise you that casting finger of death is the worst move a necro could make against a warlock. And again, that's also assuming that the warlock never gets a shot off before the necro engages him, which is already a huge presumption.

I've played both sides of this coin, and I'd much rather be the warlock in this situation.