Shattered Kingdoms

You have a point there, but that's more a problem with the economy changes than with this: Even then, the main items that are affected by the economy change in such a way are the items that are extremely popular, AKA the items that everyone already knows about, which means that any new player could say "Hey, what's this diaphanous parchment do and why is it so #@&* expensive" and get an answer. While I may be wrong, the prices for all the herbs/potions that aren't well-known should still be at a pretty manageable rate: If they aren't in high demand, they'll be set to twice their original price at worst.

Edoras seems to be confusing silver platters with playing fields. The markups right now are so insane that only a vet could tell what has been inflated due to supply and demand. But then, the entire economy model is [REDACTED] and demonstrates problems with similar approaches to economics. Apparently the prices are based on a fixed gold amount across the entire MUD, meaning that in addition to adamantine and scrolls and what not, coins can also be hoarded. Dulrik mentioned in a post awhile back that part of the problem was that (oh no!) people were keeping money in their banks instead of spending it, meaning prices were high. You'd think, you know, a smart merchant would try lowering prices to grab up all those non-purchases. The economy mechanic cannot simulate the realities that its inspirations depend on for stabilization.

A symptom of this disease can be found in the issue at hand, the limitations of store exploration becoming more compounded and pronounced.

Instead of original ideas and risk-taking to come up with potential solutions, though, Edoras has firmly espoused the "whatever, it works for vets. just become a vet." position. Telling newbies to go dig for forgotten scraps in dusty corners of the MUD is pretty much acknowledging that there's an issue and that you're fine with it as long as you measure yourself above the water line.

This isn't meant to be a thread about the economy nor Edoras' love for abusable vagueness, though. This is meant to be about the fact that the only way to learn more about an item for sale is to purchase it, and that seems to be a silly and archaic mechanic that could provide opportunities for innovation and development... if I understood the OP.

It is a shame there are not more accessible building patrons to approach to ask about how motivated community members could contribute to try to help and enrich the game world.

I presume that by "mean to have to explore" you refer to builder's intent. As a former builder, I have to disagree... well, in part. You're about half right. You have to put it in an IC perspective.

There are those hidden shops, the repositories of hard to find items or arcane lore, the black market that caters to legally-challenged tastes, high-end specialty sales where the buyer is expected to know the value of what they're purchasing before they buy it, or the dishonest who want to be secretive and so on. Yes, you are meant to "explore" those. You can find out about them ICly, or by experimentation, or (if the builder is excellent at their work) through clues that hint at their value or application.

The rest of the shops though, these are people working day to day to earn a living. They have every reason to be up-front about what their product is and does. The mage is covering the cost of those valuable reagents he needs, the blacksmith, tailor, cooper, etc, they're feeding their family. Would a good car salesman expect you to buy your vehicle while knowing about it only that which you can glean from seeing it?

The point is to treat the NPCs as if they were real players, and design for exploration accordingly. Personally, I think any builder who expects a player to identify every shop item and piece of atmosphere in their zone as a kind of "exploration" has an over-inflated sense of their own self-worth and is focusing way too much mental energy on trivial crap that players don't actually care about. Exploring is finding those kewl or hidden features, solving the quests, understanding how or why things work the way they do, discovering the undiscovered.

Not... data collection.

That's a problem common to MUDs as I see it... not treating the world of NPCs as if it were a living place. According to their respective stories, these people have founded empires and kingdoms, established great libraries, accomplished feats of might and magic, etc. Only the truly skilled explorers and proactive (PCs) go beyond that... the rest of the people had to work together in their groups... the Taslamarans, the Uxmalnites, the Nerinians, the Empire of the Bright Star... to build the world as it is now. That means consolidation of knowledge, and not just the construction kind. Much of it will be hidden or horded, but this is a deathless (in the sense of resurrection) world, and knowledge of the more common variety can't be protected by assassination or murder here. It spreads and becomes public.

In other words, one needs to look at the information being asked for and decide whether it really needs to be "explored", whether it's truly IC to keep it hidden away somewhere.

As far as shops go? Mundane tneds to be the rule, and the answer is no, specialized, those exceptions that capture the imagination? Yes.

If you really care so much, you could go identify all the items in the "unclear" stores and make astral board posts.

As for my position, I don't see why everyone has to know everything. I haven't identified everything sold by every shopkeeper in the game even across all my characters combined: In fact, there are items sold in every major city that I haven't bothered identifying, because they either looked pretty useless or I was satisfied with what I had.



No it isn't. Let's play "find the inflated items".



Did you guess 3, 4, 9, 10, and 12? You're right! Now, only one of those is going to be hard to figure out by asking other people, and the rest of the items cost less than an obsidian total if you bought one each. Given that you're more than likely going to spend way over 10 obsidian at this shop in a characters' lifetime, that's a pretty small price to pay.


Sure, some shops could stand to be more up-front with their merchandise, but I think they're the exception to the rule, and not worth making some code change on account of.

Is it really -that- hard to believe that half the people in SK that sell magical potions or items which allow you to remove beautiful women's clothing are eccentric and/or secretive?

You are eccentric and secretive, you git. Stop evaluating your ability to pull levers and start focusing on the machine they operate, and you might contribute more to these threads than very effective trolling, intentional or not.

I swear to God between the polymorph bug and this, it becomes clear when you feel your l33t tictacs are being threatened. You turn into a super short bus rider.

I'm evaluating your arguments based on what I feel to be the benefits and drawbacks to the changes you suggest. You seem to be the one that is having a hard time keeping from ad hominem arguments.

I would also like to point out that in Baldric's example, while it does look silly, in the end his fictitious character decided to buy the vial: And had he known what it was for he may not have. That's what I call good marketing.

Perhaps because I'm the one who has to deal with such a [REDACTED] hominem for a replier.

Now then, you've basically agreed to the OP after slathering your accomplishments and unsubstantiated acceptance of a current approach all over your replies, so I suppose we can call this one a consensus and move on.

No, the OP wants a full list of what almost every buyable item in the game can do, down to all the active and passive abilities of each pet.

I think that would turn shops into an excel spreadsheet of boring and take away from the atmosphere of the game.

If you find that it's such a terrible travesty that people don't know if the blazing hind can bash without buying one for themself, or exactly what that seemingly empty vial sold in Sith'a'niel does without having to buy one or interact with other SK characters, then investigate it yourself and post it on the astral boards. In the end, that's what you're suggesting the IMMs do.