Magical devices

Zekeage · **Posted:** Tue Sep 07, 2010 11:16 am

They don't need it's permission to do so. You can test the theory Rodwen, you like making characters to test boundaries. Make a warlock that would spit in Yed's face and watch how you get to keep your powers.

grep · **Joined:** Fri Apr 17, 2009 9:50 pm **Posts:** 5522

Hilarious as it is that Ardith points all this out after putting his sorcerer to bed, but, that doesn't make it any less true.

Edoras · **Posted:** Tue Sep 07, 2010 11:24 am

Strange that suddenly when Ardith switched from a sorcerer to an elven paladin, he realized that these items are totally overpowered and nonsensical, most specifically one that does extra damage to his elf.

Finger of Death, magma spray, cone of cold, acid blast, petrification, spirit aura, all of these spells are class specific, yet are readily available in scripted items, wands or staves in places that you frequented as Terrell, but nothing was wrong with them then. What's changed in your mind from then

Terrell wrote:

Terrell brandishes a totally overpowered staff.
Terrell's spell passes ineffectually through a grizzled male dwarf.
Terrell fades into existence.
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on Koln, charring his flesh severely!
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on a wraith, charring its flesh severely!
A wraith howls in agony as the magma clings to its body!
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on a wraith, charring its flesh severely!
A wraith howls in agony as the magma clings to its body!
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on a wraith, charring its flesh severely!
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on a wraith, charring its flesh severely!
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on a wraith, charring its flesh severely!
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on a wraith, charring its flesh severely!
A wraith howls in agony as the magma clings to its body!
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on a wraith, charring its flesh severely!
A wraith howls in agony as the magma clings to its body!
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on a wraith, charring its flesh severely!
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on a wraith, charring its flesh severely!
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on a wraith, charring its flesh severely!
A wraith howls in agony as the magma clings to its body!
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on a thick-maned lion, charring his flesh severely!
A thick-maned lion howls in agony as the magma clings to his body!
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on a wraith, charring its flesh severely!
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on a wraith, charring its flesh severely!
A wraith howls in agony as the magma clings to its body!
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on a wraith, charring its flesh severely!
A wraith howls in agony as the magma clings to its body!
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on a wraith, charring its flesh severely!
A wraith howls in agony as the magma clings to its body!
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on a wraith, charring its flesh severely!
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on a wraith, charring its flesh severely!
A wraith howls in agony as the magma clings to its body!
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on Jydel, charring his flesh severely!
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on a legionnaire, charring his flesh severely!
A legionnaire howls in agony as the magma clings to his body!
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on a thick-maned lion, charring his flesh severely!
A thick-maned lion howls in agony as the magma clings to his body!
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on a giant legionnaire, charring his flesh severely!
Terrell cannot bear to attack your mighty presence!
Terrell cowers away from your mighty presence!
Terrell unleashes a torrent of magma on a battered treant, charring its flesh severely!

to now?

Hellfire wands hurt less than a GM hellion casting it, they have limited charges, and they're difficult to reclaim. The acid blast and cone of cold wands already got nerfed pretty heavily. I've never seen the BoG wand before, but I'm sure that while powerful, it's not as powerful as a GM paladin casting it.

I mean, a priest hasn't dedicated his life to studying the arcane as much as a sorcerer, but he can go into the ethereal plane with just a scroll. I don't see you whining about that, even though I've put just about as much effort into obtaining that "privilege" as you have (Joining a religion and leveling to mentor is sooooo hard.).

patrisaurus · **Posted:** Tue Sep 07, 2010 12:00 pm

I actually agree with Ardith here and for reasoning that I think most responses have overlooked or at least not addressed -- it isn't that these items are incredibly more overpowered than other great wands/staves but that the spells are so uniquely related to demanding religious conduct and the favor of specific gods that it doesn't make sense that a wand-crafter would be able to craft them. As such I agree that BoG, Hellfire, and Spirit Horde/Aura should not be wands. As much as I admired the recent use of the SH wand on a certain website (props to you) it just does not make sense that any of these would make it into a wand.

grep · **Joined:** Fri Apr 17, 2009 9:50 pm **Posts:** 5522

Magic does not make sense.

Arguing logical rules for magic is like... like being really silly.

You could easily handwave it all away with an idea like ur-priests or arcane spell equivalents or maybe even the idea that the item's creator dotted all her i's and crossed all her t's and was able to make the item... what you do with a blessing after it is cast upon you is an issue of forgiveness, not permission, based on the SK religious world. If logic must be had, proof of this can be seen in things like blemish and curse.

However, for mechanics, it always stinks when one class can be any class with less risk than any other class. I agree but for that reason alone.

Dulrik · **Posted:** Tue Sep 07, 2010 12:34 pm

There is already a coded building restriction related to this. Specifically, builders are not allowed to create wands/staves/potions/pills that use a spell which is a unique to a single class and which only targets yourself. This was to prevent buffs that were supposed to be used for casters-only from being able to be used by the general population. Scrolls were exempted.

What you are describing is a more harsh form of this restriction. Not sure if I think it's a good idea or a bad idea, but it wouldn't be hard to implement.

grep · **Joined:** Fri Apr 17, 2009 9:50 pm **Posts:** 5522

If I understand you correctly, a wand of etherealform is a flagrant violation?

Dulrik · **Posted:** Tue Sep 07, 2010 12:44 pm

And.... yes, it is. So that should go away. There's probably a line in a warning log somewhere saying that it is violating the rules. :-?

Edoras · **Posted:** Tue Sep 07, 2010 12:45 pm

Dulrik wrote:

Specifically, builders are not allowed to create wands/staves/potions/pills that use a spell which is a unique to a single class and which only targets yourself. This was to prevent buffs that were supposed to be used for casters-only from being able to be used by the general population. Scrolls were exempted.

Well, unless you're also referring to spells that cannot be brewed/scribed, I don't see what that -would- apply to, unless you consider spirit horde a defensive buff.

However, if you ARE referring to spells that can be scribed/brewed but are self-only spells, there are plenty of staves and wands for etherealform, mirror image, ironguard, spirit aura, spirit horde, resist elements, stone skin and death shroud that need to be altered, some of which have been around for a LONG time.

And by plenty I mean at least twenty.

Dulrik · **Posted:** Tue Sep 07, 2010 12:52 pm

I'm looking at the code that is supposed to be telling the builders not to do that, and it looks like it ought to work, but it might be broken. I'll have to do more testing on it when I have a chance.

Shattered Kingdoms

Magical devices

Who is online