Shattered Kingdoms

Charm person should stop someone from attacking you and cause them to be unable to attack you for the remainder that it is up. Remove the ordering crap and leave that to dominate. Leave it unchanged for NPCs of course though.

That's why paladins should always carry around a seppuku dagger.

So they can kill themselves if some necro/evil sorc charms them and orders them to kill innocent children.

Because if I were evil, I'd totally do that.

What do you mean IF?

God, some of you are so huge crybabies. Charm spell should completely put someone under the mage's command, period. All the rest is just crap because you hate it when you get charmed, but so it is, just like you hate it when you get crit-cleaved or backstabed or anything that puts you in a real hard place. But that's the game, in some situations you do get in a hard place if you don't prepare your character to resist them,

I'm of the party that charm person is complete control over the victims mind and actions. That doesn't mean it's the correct interpretation but we'll never know unless the immstaff comes out and tells us exactly how a charmee is supposed to view their master. IE: A complete slave to their will, or simply highly affectionate but not willing to do anything to outrageous like kill an ally.

I prefer the complete slave approach really and think charm should be treated just like dominate, the caster sacrifices his/her melee abilities for increased magical power, thus the ability to enslave more powerful beings. If your master wants you to remove all your equipment and junk it or give it to him/her you should, because you're enthralled to his/her will.

Either way their's arguments for both sides of the fence, and no argument holds any more or less water than the other, it's simply a matter of player opinion at the moment and it would be nice if there was clarification on exactly how the spell is suppose to play out.

IMHO, charm is now the most powerful pkill spell in the game. For some reason I'm never hit by petrifications or FoD (fully) on any character. Yet I've had gnome priests with decent enchants and sorcs hit by cast charm, and now a GM merc with >20 willpower hit by an easily available scroll.

Clearly it's not going to get wimped anytime soon though.

What I do think should be done is that whatever idiot put numerous strong/overpowered high level scrolls into an easily accesible part of the game should get off his [REDACTED] and remove them. Most of these things were removed a few years back - why on earth did someone think that just because time had passed, it was time to put them back?

If charm is meant to be a complete domination of will, it's an "I win" spell. Therefore it should have mana cost and cast time similar to petrification as opposed to its current speed and cost.

Pretty much what Konge said.

Uh I don't believe that with over 20 will power you can get charmed with scrolls. I did testing with Amadre and with roughly 24 will I was resisting his 16 art 24 cha gm sorc charms about 4/5 times. That means I was left with roughly 8 willpower, and even that small amount helped a shitload. I don't believe that after taking into account the -6 from scrolls you would still get charmed with 14 will. although maybe you guys just have awful wisdom and don't realize that its probably raping your roll against all forms of mental attacks.

But yes, charm is one of the most vicious spells in the game now. However nothing has changed in the last long while so the fact that your all figuring this out now is laughable. Also those scrolls in tlaxcala have been around for ages so complaining about those is laughable too.

I want 16 art