Shattered Kingdoms

Where Roleplay and Tactics Collide
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 6:14 am 
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Immortal

Joined: Sat May 07, 2005 8:16 am
Posts: 4124
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada
SK Character: Achernar
As far as I can tell there was IC reasons behind your characters death. Were you an innocent bystander? Yes. Were you a victim of a certain identity stealing ability? Yes. Do I blame anyone for the clusterfuck? Yes. Neither you or your killer are to blame. The party to blame is the person who stole your identity.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 6:16 am 
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Joined: Fri Apr 17, 2009 9:50 pm
Posts: 5522
Achernar wrote:
As far as I can tell there was IC reasons behind your characters death. Were you an innocent bystander? Yes. Were you a victim of a certain identity stealing ability? Yes. Do I blame anyone for the clusterfuck? Yes. Neither you or your killer are to blame. The party to blame is the person who stole your identity.


Anonymous, huh? Check.
Does not forgive? Check. Maybe.
Legion? Cheeeeeeck. :roll:

I didn't know you guys had a /b/

The cancer that is killing SK, then? I guess things like that had a certain charm or trendy..je ne sais quoi..back in the "golden age," but all these afterlife posts lead one to wonder if eternal september is going to arrive again this fall.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 6:43 am 
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Joined: Sat May 07, 2005 8:16 am
Posts: 4124
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada
SK Character: Achernar
Quote:
Anonymous, huh? Check.
Does not forgive? Check. Maybe.
Legion? Cheeeeeeck.

I didn't know you guys had a /b/

The cancer that is killing SK, then? I guess things like that had a certain charm or trendy..je ne sais quoi..back in the "golden age," but all these afterlife posts lead one to wonder if eternal september is going to arrive again this fall.

Translate please?

My first reaction was to curse the bejeezus out of the person who caused this reaction. After getting more explanation, I'm convinced the player who killed Fril wasn't misbehaving at all. He was retaliating against an attempted murder made on his character by someone who had stolen Fril's identity. Death happens. Its nothing we can prevent. I'm not certain that I really agree with Sineran's reaction, but its certainly his choice. I have enjoyed many of his efforts, but its sometimes time for a break.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 7:07 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 09, 2004 8:43 am
Posts: 5614
Location: Columbia, South Carolina
SK Character: Pilnor, Surrit, Berr, Rall
Achernar wrote:
After getting more explanation, I'm convinced the player who killed Fril wasn't misbehaving at all.


That's the worst problem, though: The "golden rule" was clearly broken in this scenario, regardless of how many times it was broken in the events leading up to it. A kill on a ~10 levels lower target, full loot and walk away without even a single word essentially puts a player back a set number of -hours,- often forcing them to log off if there are no friendly priests online, and without anything at all to show the person who you just killed. It happened to me numerous times playing, and I reported it then: Always getting the "They didn't break the rules" response.

The golden rule has never been enforced except in very extreme cases, and perhaps that's a good thing if the immortals can't keep themselves from being biased in all cases of punishment. But that doesn't keep random people on a power trip from completely ruining the game for others. Was Sineran's reaction the best? Probably: When a game isn't fun anymore, you should stop playing. How exactly you as the staff want to deal with people who have no problem with wordless PKilling and full looting is honestly going to have a large impact on how fun the game is. But to say that a kill and full loot on a sleeping character without any consideration for that player before or after the kill wasn't breaking the rules at all? That's the sort of thing that contributed to me not wanting to play.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 7:16 am 
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Joined: Fri Apr 17, 2009 9:50 pm
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Oh, sorry, too much jargon.

I'm just comparing the ways that Certain Spell winds up being used to the typical trolling activities of modern-day internet users: for example, the Habbo Hotel or Otakon raids, wherein a large swath of people in fake suits and afros go and swarm a place with sheer numbers and anonymity. Then, on the other of the MUD curtain, we have people getting caught up and dying in what look like loot grab runs and, of course, the whole besieging thing that's come up before, recently.

Death happens, and you have to accept anything if you want to enjoy an "anything goes" game, but I was thinking about how most of the disenfranchised people seem to be victims of related flavors of MUD fare.

On the internet community the infamous /b/ is part of, these "raid" activities and the newbie-like people who conduct them with neither elegance nor eloquence are often called "the cancer that is killing /b/," along with, well, anything the poster doesn't quite like. Its not really high-browed enough to warrant an explanation, but I hope I was able to make sense of it for ya.

One of the rallying cries of those raiders goes something like "because none of us is as cruel as all of us."

I guess grief-causing Spells and Skills are a great way to promote CRS, though? ;)


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 7:23 am 
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Edoras wrote:
But that doesn't keep random people on a power trip from completely ruining the game for others. Was Sineran's reaction the best? Probably: When a game isn't fun anymore, you should stop playing. How exactly you as the staff want to deal with people who have no problem with wordless PKilling and full looting is honestly going to have a large impact on how fun the game is. But to say that a kill and full loot on a sleeping character without any consideration for that player before or after the kill wasn't breaking the rules at all? That's the sort of thing that contributed to me not wanting to play.


QFT, but that's not to say players can't put up a resistance in-game, as well. My character, for example, resurrects and re-equips such victims, often at the risk of being cursed if I'm being watched without the context being known. I'd rather go to the staff after I've exhausted the tools they've already given me, not before.. otherwise its an RPless kill with an RPless reaction, and where's the fun in that for any staff member? They deserve as much RP as we demand for ourselves, I think.

The only thing in the way of people who want to make your experience poor is, well, you. Rather than walking away from the game, I look at it as a challenge no other ruleset would really provide for. That is, of course, assuming that victory is indeed a possibility. Perhaps in a few months my honeymoon phase will wear off, but until then, if people want to be troubles, well, troubleshooting is as fun as anything, isn't it, Citizen?


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 7:51 am 
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Joined: Sat May 07, 2005 8:16 am
Posts: 4124
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada
SK Character: Achernar
Edoras wrote:
Achernar wrote:
After getting more explanation, I'm convinced the player who killed Fril wasn't misbehaving at all.


That's the worst problem, though: The "golden rule" was clearly broken in this scenario, regardless of how many times it was broken in the events leading up to it. A kill on a ~10 levels lower target, full loot and walk away without even a single word essentially puts a player back a set number of -hours,- often forcing them to log off if there are no friendly priests online, and without anything at all to show the person who you just killed. It happened to me numerous times playing, and I reported it then: Always getting the "They didn't break the rules" response.

The golden rule has never been enforced except in very extreme cases, and perhaps that's a good thing if the immortals can't keep themselves from being biased in all cases of punishment. But that doesn't keep random people on a power trip from completely ruining the game for others. Was Sineran's reaction the best? Probably: When a game isn't fun anymore, you should stop playing. How exactly you as the staff want to deal with people who have no problem with wordless PKilling and full looting is honestly going to have a large impact on how fun the game is. But to say that a kill and full loot on a sleeping character without any consideration for that player before or after the kill wasn't breaking the rules at all? That's the sort of thing that contributed to me not wanting to play.

I could probably agree with cursing the people in the player group abusing the identity stealing ability. They're the real jackasses in this situation, not the person everyone blames. As far as I could tell, the killer was willing to stay IC to explain what happened, but it was assumed the situation was all OOC and deletion in frustration ensued. I'm not sure that there's an ideal solution. We rarely dole out punishments because its really hard to find someone who should be blamed. In this instance, I blame the person stealing the identity for not following through with their roleplay obligation. Shall I punish them? As far as I can tell Fril's killer was willing to make amends ICly and through RP for the killing, so I don't know how he should be blamed for responding to someone who he thought attacked him.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 4:55 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2005 7:50 pm
Posts: 1798
All the GRPs, stand-alone RPs, and Bonanzas the immortals have been holding are greatly appreciated. It is just that the game has been the same since forever. Most of us have played 10+ years by now and we have been in the same cabals for so many times already. We have done the same knightly, priestly, religious roleplays for soooo many times.

We could use new features!


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 10:25 pm 
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Joined: Wed May 05, 2004 1:58 am
Posts: 2423
Location: Athens, Greece
I have no idea who killed Fril, but even if it was a misunderstanding due to stolen identity, no-person should RPlessly full-junk-loot a level 10 character and get away with it.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 10:29 pm 
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Immortal (Inactive)

Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2008 3:22 pm
Posts: 1049
SK Character: Ain
Now that, is how you play the telephone game on a forum.

Quote:
A kill on a ~10 levels lower target


becomes

Quote:
a level 10 character


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