Shattered Kingdoms

Seriously?

Because we are discussing class strengths, not cabal or tribunal strengths. It's only natural that any class would become more powerful in an organization.

It's also interesting how you have the merc use cabal abilities, whereas you don't mention a single thing the sorc could do.

Yeah, is the sorcerer supposed to give a damn when he can just zap etherealform when the chips start getting down? There's also tons of charms out there for a sorcerer to get. It's not like oh damn Lathron and Losquaty are dead, I can't do anything until they respawn. This is something that you've abused yourself, to zap etherealform and then come back 5 minutes later with more NPCs in tow. In fact it's downright [REDACTED] and annoying that anybody with the scrolls or wands skills can get away that easily. Especially through taunt and bolt of glory. You're pretty fortunate that all of the etherealform pills and potions were removed from the game years ago, but [REDACTED], if my sorcerer was taunted, would he have the mental faculties to zap etherealform because he would know that it would allow him to escape, and in your case drop back in 5 minutes later to try to gank said PCs again. No, this an act of the player saving the character.

I'm not sure how a solo mercenary, even if he is in the hammer is supposed to hope to defeat a sorcerer. It's not like anybody forces the player to use dark aura NPCs. There are plenty of grey aura and white aura NPCs that can be used to work around the [adhesive medical strip] that members of that cabal use. [Adhesive medical strip] can also not be used to defend against both bash and trip at the same time or taunt.

I also don't see why it is acceptable that it should take a team of people working together to take down 1 guy. Isn't that just an argument for how overpowered a class can be?

There should be a reward for higher intelligence and age ticking in a sorceror.

This proposal won't help crap. It will nerf deep-elf sorcerors who can't cast hardly anything while holding two charms AND charm can't be scribed, so it's not like it will really effect anyone else because no one else has the int to effectively control two charms.

Tribunal sorcerors will still roll with 2 NPCs and a pet anyway.

REMOVE TRIBUNALS IT IS THE ROOT OF THE NPC WAR PROBLEM

REMOVE THEM, PROBLEM SOLVED

Besides, with remove compulsion priests a dime a dozen I don't see how this is even remotely an issue. My sorc got roflstomped by remove compulsion.

Edoras, necromancer is the only class that can beat a delf sorcerer 1v1. Seriously. I'll give you ANY class/race/faction combo, FULLY prepped, and the absolute best they can hope for is a draw at the end of a very risky fight. Most combinations of 2 PCs, when played by competent, prepared players, do stand a chance against a sorc. Once you've got three decent players, things are stacked against the sorcerer. The combo is just too OP.


Uh, you're just wrong. Delf sorcs run around with two charmies all the time. And since scrolls/wands/staves don't take concentration, these sorcs tend to recite triple FoD, triple harm, or double petrification. Or hell, they can zap OP fear, OP cone of cold, OP acid blast, or OP color spray. I'm sorry, but you don't know what you're talking about. The ability to hold two charms is one of the reasons that delf and human sorcs are in a league of their own, and you might be surprised by how much spare concentration they actually have when holding two charms. Also, the ability to charm players while already holding a charm is definitely a big deal, whether or not it's a tactic Edoras uses.


Remove compulsion has a huge casting time. If you lost while playing a sorc, you just don't understand how to play the class. Sorry, that's as nicely as I can put it.


Also, sorcs don't actually have weaknesses, and this whole "glass cannon" nonsense is a bunch of propaganda. The class is nearly unkillable because they're always in the third row and have easy access to every defensive buff in the game. The only way to die while playing a sorc is to be incompetent. Examples include going afk, not holding MI, trying to go 1v6, or not keeping track of true seeing potions in the game.

And I'm assuming Mira's stamp of approval is for the original idea in the thread and not the abolition of tribunals.

Lastly, I will point out that Orius voted not to implement this change, but that's because he wanted to keep thing so that one player was able to take on the entire mud. I think that vote should be counted in my favor.

Remove compulsion has less than a round and a half casting time. Recite petrification is instant. Anytime that a group with a good remove compulsion priest goes against a sorc, that sorc immediately becomes LESS powerful than any other PC.

Dispel and cancellation are faster. With ranged weaponry or chain lightning you can remove someone's images in two rounds or less, and at that point death is just some scrolls, a dirt kick, a couple rounds of ranged combat, or a couple circle stabs away. Bolt of glory is less than a round of combat to cast.

I can't believe I even bothered responding to you in this thread. What a joke. Anyways, yeah, if a sorc sits in one spot and does nothing (instead of just raping everyone in his near vicinity), there are a few ways to force him ethereal or make him quaff word. I guess this means that it's not OP that deep-elf sorcs are able to put out the damage of two GM barbs or 1GM barb and a taunting GM swash or. . . I can't even finish this sentence. You're ridiculous, Edoras. In your defense, I think you actually convinced yourself somewhere down the line that you weren't playing an OP combo, and that your success was due to insane skills. Take a step back and think about the fact that every other experienced pvper here has disagreed with you about whether sorcs (especially delf sorcs) are OP. I'm done arguing with you because you've reached D-A levels of absurdity.

Want to know an experienced player who hasn't disagreed with me on this thread?

Lothoriel. You know why? Because every single freaking time I fought against Baba as Antiira (Except the one time he admitted to brain farting and dying), he always A) cast remove compulsion on a charm, or B) immediately recited petrification on one of my charms. If I had two charms, he did both. It's NOT hard to neutralize a sorc if you have the guts to do it. The larger a group is, and the more experienced a sorcs enemies are, the quicker those charms are going to die or be dispelled. It's just the way things are.

That's one of the dumbest straw man arguments I've ever heard. It doesn't help that one skilled player could rebuff you (but never land a kill alone); especially when compared to the fact that he's burnt a scroll, and you've lost one weapon at best (which is much easier to reclaim).

Also, don't take silence for implied support. It could just be rolling blackouts.


Having only one charm brings sorcerers back in line with other classes. They still have the most utility and survivability of any class available. This change should have been introduced at the same time as necros getting animate dead.