Shattered Kingdoms

I approve of this idea.

There is absolutely no issue with hp dumping, even with warlocks and necromancers it was never, and won't ever be a useful tactic.

It was done for pseudo-balance, between art/hp/mana/move if I remember right everyone having roughly the same number.

For instance, if you can train art 10 times, and you can train move 5 times, you can only train hp 3 times. Whereas another class could train art 3 times, move 5 times, and hp 10 times. Not exact numbers of course, but it's the same general idea. Also if I recall correctly, move trains were boosted at the same time to make them a bit more worthwhile. Either way, it's all kind of fuzzy.

However, it's completely wrong that warlocks/necromancers would have balance issues due to hp dumping. That's just not the case, nor was it the main reasoning behind it.

I can get on board with increasing the available number of stat trains for HP. I thought the reason was warlocks, but heck, everyone seems to have little reason for not doing so.

I'm fine with changing this back. It would just increase the diversity possible builds out there without unbalancing anything.

The only two thing it actually unbalances in a very minor ways are long lived races and the mentor system, and warrior classes versus those that have spells. Basically, the hp cap is very low on casters, but they have art to drop extra points in, as well as mana if they are just overflowing with points. Warriors only have hp, and to a much lesser extent move.

Neither of these are huge imbalances.

Yeah I agree. I should have said "unduly" unbalancing. A caster that ends up in the front row is a dead caster, so the only things HP dumping would really help for are voodoo, backstab, ambush, etc. And even so, you'd have to dump significant trains into HP at the expense of other things (i.e. art, stats) to really have much of an effect.

Shaman tank!?!?

A shaman tank needs str, dex, int, wis, con pretty much maxed to be effective. How much room would that leave for hp trains? Or, if you go hp trains, how many enchants to do you have to give up for att mods?

Would just be another possible build. I don't remember people even doing this when it was possible with shamans (not sure why). Only shaman I ever played was a voodoo cannon build gnome (when gnome int was around 18!).

And let's not forget how those undead would still take one bog to kill with all those extra hps. That's seriously overpowered.

Of course this would be imbalanced. Those 20 hp trains are absolutely huge for a warlock or a necromancer or a priest, or a sorc. They'll get 9 art for wands or the pros might only get 3 art for their staves. Now i'm not saying that it wouldn't be fair for the people they are fighting, im saying it wouldn't be fair for all the gms now who would end up completely inferior to their new counterparts. Personally I think if your going to raise the max stat cap for casters you should raise the max hp cap for all other classes. Also stat trains should be refundable for those who already spent all of them.