Shattered Kingdoms

Been there, done that. It didn't stick.

This isn't forum 'whining', this is discussion. I feel it is vital to the longevity of this mud for different players to constantly evaluate the status quo and debate it.

This gives information and feedback to the staff and allows for them to also give their points of view.

I don't ever discourage someone from adding to the conversation as long as it is a constructive criticism.

Although Grakus' presentation is, as usual, lacking in grace, I agree with him on a number of points. While I don't know the status quo of the game, the Fist as I remember it was in an alright place, but I found myself asking many of the same questions that Grakus is asking.

The current Fist concept doesn't leave a lot of room for leading a city, which is what the Talon is about - it's good that they're separate entities, but it does diminish the "point" of the Fist, mainly because the Fist and the Talon do not have as much synergy as the Hammer and the Keepers. The Talon and the Fist usually work together, but the Fist will certainly not be coming in to fill up the Talon ranks in an offensive war, and the two remain more or less diplomatically independant of each other, often unlike their Western counterparts. The same situation is true of the Druids and the Guardians, but to a greater extent - the Druids have a world goal in mind (like the Hammer), which may or may not coincide with what the Guardians are working for.

It's pretty easy to see where the problem is when you look at the Fist from this regard - the Fist, although they have a set of goals and virtues (which is why the fit in the principled category), do not have a purpose or any real end-game goal. Every organization has vision for how to craft the world, and although we know none of them will ever reach it, it's the job of the players to do their best to try and reach those goals while recognizing OOCly that they'll never truly attain them. What would the world look like with the Fist in charge? Well, that's just the thing, they wouldn't be in charge. Their concept doesn't allow it - they have to stand on the side-lines, which basically relegates them to Hammer support and occasional interference in various matters. This in and of itself is not a problem, but when you give a support cabal powers worthy of a primary cabal, it causes the balance issues that GL and Grakus have noted.

To me the current RPed version of the Fists just don't fit into the rest of the game. Is it our task as players to try to "force" them into some sort of RP that we agree to, or is it our responsibility to allow them to play in a manner that is entertaining to them?






That is something a community based around something would do Grakus. You cant have your cake and eat it too. Ether you don't want to be involved in the community or you do. Make up your mind. If you don't want to be in the community then this is whining and moaning. If you do want to be in the community then it is a discussion.